tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post5190097766557705796..comments2024-03-28T19:56:42.305-05:00Comments on Alexander Pruss's Blog: Can our cells be substances?Alexander R Prusshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-36221020939256566872019-02-18T15:11:09.220-06:002019-02-18T15:11:09.220-06:00It looks like it, but I don't think it needs t...It looks like it, but I don't think it needs to be. You could get an electrode attached to a nerve, and feel a pinprick when electricity is sent along the electrode, but the electrode need not be a part of you.Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-35917844807315316652019-02-18T10:24:14.720-06:002019-02-18T10:24:14.720-06:00What about internal perceptions though? I see what...What about internal perceptions though? I see what you mean re pushing a part around that need not belong to you (any more than your sleeve) but if Abby and Brittany both simultaneously feel a pinprick, doesn't that look like an area of shared control? Helen Watthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17086954734757237040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-25623730554382216872019-02-18T10:08:21.933-06:002019-02-18T10:08:21.933-06:00There are two kinds of control that our form exert...There are two kinds of control that our form exerts. One kind is purely causal. This kind of control we have both over our bodies and over things in our environment. When I move my arm, my sleeves move as well, even though my sleeves are not a part of me. This kind of control is empirically observable. The other kind is where the form is directly responsible for the characteristic physical behavior of the parts. The reason the carbon nuclei in my body attract the electrons that orbit them is because my form gives them their characteristic behavior. This kind of control is not empirically observable. When a bit of me leaves my body, carbon nuclei continue to attract electrons, as far as we know in exactly the same way. But on an Aristotelian metaphysics, there is a substantial change there, and the carbon nuclei and electrons are under the sway of a different form (or forms). It is the second the kind of control that we would need to look for to see whether a bit of matter is a part of the substance. But since this second kind of control is not empirically observable, as far as we know, we can't figure this out empirically.Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-68569709392365840362019-02-18T09:59:34.876-06:002019-02-18T09:59:34.876-06:00That could be, but it doesn't look like it - ...That could be, but it doesn't look like it - Abby and Brittany Hensel, for example, each manage one side of their conjoined body and the sense of touch is also restricted, however seemingly there is a small amount of overlap at the midline. I suppose theoretically they could be controlling very close parts but it does look as if both are controlling both (and then there are parts of the body that aren't sentient or under conscious control- seemingly common organs, shared blood circulating etc).Helen Watthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17086954734757237040noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-40235755538523261082019-02-18T09:40:23.101-06:002019-02-18T09:40:23.101-06:00That's a good point. But perhaps we can still ...That's a good point. But perhaps we can still say that there is a fact of the matter as to which form has which bit of matter under its sway, albeit a fact not knowable by us?Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-58458565150321105062019-02-17T08:11:23.693-06:002019-02-17T08:11:23.693-06:00Doesn't any theory though have to fit conjoine...Doesn't any theory though have to fit conjoined twins (let's say, two heads, one body) who are definitely two self-directed bodily organisms/substances but who also definitely share some matter which is part of both and under the control of both? If some terrible injury left only the shared parts behind and life still seems to be present I agree there seems a problem with saying that both twins are still there - as opposed perhaps to saying that one twin as the centre of control (which, you may not know) has completely 'taken over'. Plus, even non-conjoined twins can share the fetal placenta etc.Helen Watthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17086954734757237040noreply@blogger.com