tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post2295630827796540457..comments2024-03-27T20:37:09.185-05:00Comments on Alexander Pruss's Blog: Are we all seriously impaired?Alexander R Prusshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-71812835890899608952016-11-30T10:28:36.630-06:002016-11-30T10:28:36.630-06:00Well, as a matter of fact, I have always thought t...Well, as a matter of fact, I have always thought that God's reaction in the story was excessive. <br />To say that for the action to be a moral sin, Adam had to have the ability to refrain seems question-begging, because I think one should first consider whether the Fall-story really includes a (mortal) sin rather than a mistake due to Adam's imperfection . I think that if we are to take your description of 'what normal human beings should be able to do' to its consequences, we have to go for the latter option.<br /><br />But I feel we'll have to agree to disagree on this.Walter Van den Ackerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16101735542155226072noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-43315959813890319342016-11-30T09:28:55.354-06:002016-11-30T09:28:55.354-06:00No, I meant it in a pretty broad way. On the pictu...No, I meant it in a pretty broad way. On the picture you sketch, Adam wasn't very responsible, and then God's reaction would have been excessive. For the action to be the mortal sin it was, Adam had to have the capability to refrain.Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-91904581837780942132016-11-30T09:15:11.895-06:002016-11-30T09:15:11.895-06:00Dr Pruss
I think you are using a very narrow unde...<br />Dr Pruss<br /><br />I think you are using a very narrow understanding of 'being able' here. In my opinion, if Adam had truly been able to avoid the fall, he would have avoided it. But I use 'able' in a much broader sense, and I think, in the context of this argument the broader sense is required, because what is the difference between human normalcy and human perfection?<br /><br /><br />Just like I am not smart enough to fully understand quantum mechanics, Adam apparently was not smart enough to understand the consequences of his choice. Or maybe he was too weak. All these things to me clearly fall under imperfection. If human normalcy entails human perfection, and I don't see what else 'what human beings should be able to do' could possibly mean, then being too weak to do something or to avoid something is also an inability<br /> Walter Van den Ackerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16101735542155226072noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-84332487030469376652016-11-30T08:12:18.072-06:002016-11-30T08:12:18.072-06:00Adam fell short of what he was able to do. That...Adam fell short of what he was able to do. That's why it was a sin.Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-73915826532125860942016-11-30T00:30:56.190-06:002016-11-30T00:30:56.190-06:00Dr Pruss
I really don't think the Christian d...Dr Pruss<br /><br />I really don't think the Christian doctrine of the Fall can account for why "all of us fall seriously short of what normal human beings should be able to do."<br /><br />The problem is that the things you describe as what normal human beings should be able to do<br /><br />"they would have capacities enabling them to do calculus, understand Newtonian physics, write a well-argued essay, deal well with emotions, avoid fallacies, sing decently, have a good marriage, etc." includes "avoid fallacies". But if before the Fall, humans had been the way humans should be, they would have avoided the Fall. It's only because Adam (figuratively speaking) fell short of what a normal being should be able to do, that the Fall happened in the first place.Walter Van den Ackerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16101735542155226072noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-6709885506513489492016-11-29T10:24:46.125-06:002016-11-29T10:24:46.125-06:00Augustine seems to have thought that in the Garden...Augustine seems to have thought that in the Garden, we had total voluntary control over our bodies' functioning. The lack of that is a serious impairment.Alexander R Prusshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05989277655934827117noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-3891434218564545511.post-64682367268957025702016-11-28T18:12:45.286-06:002016-11-28T18:12:45.286-06:00Malebranche held something like this on broadly Ca...Malebranche held something like this on broadly Cartesian grounds: he held that we can recognize by rational reflection on mind and body that their natural relationship should have certain features and when we comare this discovery to our actual mind-body relationships we learn that some of those features are missing. This affects our cognition -- we are over-dependent on the senses, and so have difficulty paying adequate attention to abstract ideas. He also held that it interfered with our control of the bodies, so, while he doesn't give it a large scope, he can be said to have held that there was a physical disability aspect, as well.Brandonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06698839146562734910noreply@blogger.com